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Thread started 10/07/19 3:48am

benni

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Trump gives the Kurdish people to Turkey...

EGPoxwIXYAAa3xW?format=jpg&name=large


Turkey has wanted this to be able to decimate the Kurds. Putin has also wanted this. This will be a genocide. The Kurdish people were our allies, fought ISIS along side our troops. Were a tremendous help during that fight, and this is what our country (Trump) gives them in return.

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Reply #1 posted 10/07/19 6:27am

Musicslave

I don't expect loyalty or any virtue from this president. Not surprised. Allies around the world be warned or be damned. Forewarned is forearmed.

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Reply #2 posted 10/07/19 7:05am

RodeoSchro

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Musicslave said:

I don't expect loyalty or any virtue from this president. Not surprised. Allies around the world be warned or be damned. Forewarned is forearmed.



He is the epitome of "What have you done for me lately?" And if he thinks the answer is "Not much" then he'll drop you faster than the New York Jets' receivers drop passes.

Second Funkiest White Man in America

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Reply #3 posted 10/07/19 7:21am

benni

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: "I just spoke to a Kurdish official. He said that the Americans have betrayed us. They have opened the door for a Turkish massacre."
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Reply #4 posted 10/07/19 7:23am

benni

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Reply #5 posted 10/07/19 7:27am

2freaky4church
1

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We always betray the Kurds. One issue where I sided with our foreign policy. Even Fox went after trump. I will no longer capitalize its name.

Russia needs to aid the Kurds.

All you others say Hell Yea!! woot!
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Reply #6 posted 10/07/19 7:32am

poppys

It horrifies me but it's not just Trump.

We did the same thing after WWII when Israel was created, Germany carved up, and we allowed everyone behind the "Iron Curtain" to be dealt with by Stalin. Among many other "deals", good and bad depending. History repeats itself - and history is brutal.

politics: the art or science of government.
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Reply #7 posted 10/07/19 7:36am

benni

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Brett McGurk (special envoy who resigned over this very issue in December 2018) said this on twitter:


Donald Trump is not a Commander-in-Chief. He makes impulsive decisions with no knowledge or deliberation. He sends military personnel into harm’s way with no backing. He blusters and then leaves our allies exposed when adversaries call his bluff or he confronts a hard phone call.

The WH statement tonight on Syria after Trump spoke with Erdogan demonstrates a complete lack of understanding of anything happening on the ground. The “United States” is not holding any ISIS detainees. They are all being held by the SDF, which Trump just served up to Turkey.


Turkey has neither the intent, desire, nor capacity to manage 60k detainees in al Hol camp, which State and DoD IGs warn is the nucleus for a resurgent ISIS. Believing otherwise is a reckless gamble with our national security. Background here👇 thesoufancenter.org/wp-content/upl…


The Turkish proposed “safe zone” would effectively extend Turkey’s border 30km into Syria, including areas of Christians, Kurds, and other vulnerable minorities. Our diplomats were working on a plan to forestall such a debacle. Where’s Pompeo?


Indeed, US officials signed the SDF up to a “security mechanism” plan by which it removed all defensive barriers on the Syrian side of the border to forestall a Turkish incursion. EUCOM issued this just yesterday. Was Trump ever even briefed on this plan?


Trump made a similarly impulsive decision when I was managing the policy. I resigned over it and stand by every word in this op-ed. Tonight is a sad replay but seems even worse as US officials had since convinced the SDF that we planned to stay. washingtonpost.com/outlook/trump-…


There’s a similar defect at the core of US foreign policies across the board: maximalist objectives for a minimalist president combined with no process to assess facts, develop options, or prepare contingencies. Our personnel are left exposed at the slightest moment of friction.


Bottom line: Trump tonight after one call with a foreign leader provided a gift to Russia, Iran, and ISIS. FWIW, I warned of this here in @ForeignAffairs — and recommended alternatives given the hard realities on the ground and in this White House.
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Reply #8 posted 10/07/19 11:32am

RodeoSchro

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benni said:

Brett McGurk (special envoy who resigned over this very issue in December 2018) said this on twitter:


Donald Trump is not a Commander-in-Chief. He makes impulsive decisions with no knowledge or deliberation. He sends military personnel into harm’s way with no backing. He blusters and then leaves our allies exposed when adversaries call his bluff or he confronts a hard phone call.

The WH statement tonight on Syria after Trump spoke with Erdogan demonstrates a complete lack of understanding of anything happening on the ground. The “United States” is not holding any ISIS detainees. They are all being held by the SDF, which Trump just served up to Turkey.


Turkey has neither the intent, desire, nor capacity to manage 60k detainees in al Hol camp, which State and DoD IGs warn is the nucleus for a resurgent ISIS. Believing otherwise is a reckless gamble with our national security. Background here👇 thesoufancenter.org/wp-content/upl…


The Turkish proposed “safe zone” would effectively extend Turkey’s border 30km into Syria, including areas of Christians, Kurds, and other vulnerable minorities. Our diplomats were working on a plan to forestall such a debacle. Where’s Pompeo?


Indeed, US officials signed the SDF up to a “security mechanism” plan by which it removed all defensive barriers on the Syrian side of the border to forestall a Turkish incursion. EUCOM issued this just yesterday. Was Trump ever even briefed on this plan?


Trump made a similarly impulsive decision when I was managing the policy. I resigned over it and stand by every word in this op-ed. Tonight is a sad replay but seems even worse as US officials had since convinced the SDF that we planned to stay. washingtonpost.com/outlook/trump-…


There’s a similar defect at the core of US foreign policies across the board: maximalist objectives for a minimalist president combined with no process to assess facts, develop options, or prepare contingencies. Our personnel are left exposed at the slightest moment of friction.


Bottom line: Trump tonight after one call with a foreign leader provided a gift to Russia, Iran, and ISIS. FWIW, I warned of this here in @ForeignAffairs — and recommended alternatives given the hard realities on the ground and in this White House.



I can't wait until someone calls Trump "pig vomit diarrhea".

Second Funkiest White Man in America

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Reply #9 posted 10/07/19 11:38am

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

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I'll defend Trump on this. It's mess with no real oversight or actual stratagey or objective that is doomed to flail for as long as we alowed it.

.

It looks bad but it's the right thing to do.

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Reply #10 posted 10/07/19 11:51am

poppys

Defend Trump? What cable TV show are you watching that gives you this instant opinion?


[Edited 10/9/19 8:26am]

politics: the art or science of government.
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Reply #11 posted 10/07/19 1:35pm

RodeoSchro

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Unrepentant serial adulterer Donald J. Trump is really asking for the 25th Amendment to be put into play:

"As I have stated strongly before, and just to reiterate, if Turkey does anything that I, in my great and unmatched wisdom, consider to be off limits, I will totally destroy and obliterate the Economy of Turkey (I've done before!),"

(I)n my great and unmatched wisdom?!?

No one with complete command of their faculties would issue an official statement with that kind of wording.

The man is nuts, and people are probably going to die because of it.

And who else's economy besides ours has he destroyed?!?

Second Funkiest White Man in America

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Reply #12 posted 10/07/19 2:04pm

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

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Here's my question. How do we think this would be resolved? What's the timeline? In our lifetime? How long must we stay there? The whole thing is so nebulous.
Unless the US decides that it will permanently remain there, I see no way out.

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Reply #13 posted 10/07/19 2:21pm

DiminutiveRock
er

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RodeoSchro said:

Unrepentant serial adulterer Donald J. Trump is really asking for the 25th Amendment to be put into play:

"As I have stated strongly before, and just to reiterate, if Turkey does anything that I, in my great and unmatched wisdom, consider to be off limits, I will totally destroy and obliterate the Economy of Turkey (I've done before!),"

(I)n my great and unmatched wisdom?!?

No one with complete command of their faculties would issue an official statement with that kind of wording.

The man is nuts, and people are probably going to die because of it.

And who else's economy besides ours has he destroyed?!?

eek He is beyond unhinged.

"Families are torn apart, men women and children are separated. Children come home from school to find their parents have gone missing." - Anne Frank
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Reply #14 posted 10/07/19 3:04pm

benni

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Ugot2shakesumthin said:

Here's my question. How do we think this would be resolved? What's the timeline? In our lifetime? How long must we stay there? The whole thing is so nebulous.
Unless the US decides that it will permanently remain there, I see no way out.


Right now, we are the only thing keeping ISIS from coming back. The Kurds are holding the ISIS members that we have captured, but they are not going to be able to do that and fight against Turkey. Turkey will obliterate the Kurds. These are men and woman who have fought alongside our troops (and have lost numerous of their own people) to fight ISIS. We made a promise to them that we would not leave them to Turkey.

The issue is that this benefits no one but Russia, Iran, and Turkey. These were OUR allies and we have now turned our back on them. For what? Trump Tower Istanbul? (And yes, there is a Trump Tower in Istanbul, Turkey).

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Reply #15 posted 10/07/19 3:06pm

benni

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Now Trump is now considering pulling out of the Open Skies Treaty.


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Reply #16 posted 10/07/19 3:33pm

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

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benni said:

Ugot2shakesumthin said:

Here's my question. How do we think this would be resolved? What's the timeline? In our lifetime? How long must we stay there? The whole thing is so nebulous.
Unless the US decides that it will permanently remain there, I see no way out.


Right now, we are the only thing keeping ISIS from coming back. The Kurds are holding the ISIS members that we have captured, but they are not going to be able to do that and fight against Turkey. Turkey will obliterate the Kurds. These are men and woman who have fought alongside our troops (and have lost numerous of their own people) to fight ISIS. We made a promise to them that we would not leave them to Turkey.

The issue is that this benefits no one but Russia, Iran, and Turkey. These were OUR allies and we have now turned our back on them. For what? Trump Tower Istanbul? (And yes, there is a Trump Tower in Istanbul, Turkey).


But do you honestly feel there is a resolution here? Would we just be making this worse by extending this indefinitely?

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Reply #17 posted 10/07/19 4:13pm

KoolEaze

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RodeoSchro said:

Unrepentant serial adulterer Donald J. Trump is really asking for the 25th Amendment to be put into play:

"As I have stated strongly before, and just to reiterate, if Turkey does anything that I, in my great and unmatched wisdom, consider to be off limits, I will totally destroy and obliterate the Economy of Turkey (I've done before!),"

(I)n my great and unmatched wisdom?!?

No one with complete command of their faculties would issue an official statement with that kind of wording.

The man is nuts, and people are probably going to die because of it.

And who else's economy besides ours has he destroyed?!?

He´s done major damage to Turkey´s economy repeatedly. Say what you want about Trump but he is not bullshitting or bluffing here. Sure, the wording sounds odd and unpresidential but he is not bluffing at all. He made Turkey pay big time for not releasing Brunson earlier.

" I´d rather be a stank ass hoe because I´m not stupid. Oh my goodness! I got more drugs! I´m always funny dude...I´m hilarious! Are we gonna smoke?"




http://kooleasehvac.com/
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Reply #18 posted 10/07/19 4:19pm

KoolEaze

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benni said:

Turkey has wanted this to be able to decimate the Kurds. Putin has also wanted this. This will be a genocide. The Kurdish people were our allies, fought ISIS along side our troops. Were a tremendous help during that fight, and this is what our country (Trump) gives them in return.

That sentence is far from the truth.

It is not an ethnic conflict between Turks and Kurds, even if your media tells you so.

If that were the case, Turkey wouldn´t have sheltered hundreds and thousands of Kurds when Saddam was trying to get rid of them in the 90s. And if Turkey wanted to "decimate" Kurds it wouldn´t be doing business or have close relations with the Kurds in North Iraq.

There are many, many factors involved here but it is not an ethnic conflict.

" I´d rather be a stank ass hoe because I´m not stupid. Oh my goodness! I got more drugs! I´m always funny dude...I´m hilarious! Are we gonna smoke?"




http://kooleasehvac.com/
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Reply #19 posted 10/07/19 4:30pm

RodeoSchro

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KoolEaze said:

RodeoSchro said:

Unrepentant serial adulterer Donald J. Trump is really asking for the 25th Amendment to be put into play:

"As I have stated strongly before, and just to reiterate, if Turkey does anything that I, in my great and unmatched wisdom, consider to be off limits, I will totally destroy and obliterate the Economy of Turkey (I've done before!),"

(I)n my great and unmatched wisdom?!?

No one with complete command of their faculties would issue an official statement with that kind of wording.

The man is nuts, and people are probably going to die because of it.

And who else's economy besides ours has he destroyed?!?

He´s done major damage to Turkey´s economy repeatedly. Say what you want about Trump but he is not bullshitting or bluffing here. Sure, the wording sounds odd and unpresidential but he is not bluffing at all. He made Turkey pay big time for not releasing Brunson earlier.



I didn't know that. And I agree, he doesn't bluff. None of these Republicans do.

They absolutely lie their tails off but if they say they will do something, they do it. I hope I never hear another Democrat say about a Republican threat, "Oh sure they say that, but they'll never do that".

They will absolutely do whatever they said they'd do.

Second Funkiest White Man in America

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Reply #20 posted 10/07/19 4:31pm

KoolEaze

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Ugot2shakesumthin said:

I'll defend Trump on this. It's mess with no real oversight or actual stratagey or objective that is doomed to flail for as long as we alowed it.

.

It looks bad but it's the right thing to do.

At least he´s keeping his campaign promise of bringing back the troops and so far he´s actually more peaceful than his predecessors. I´m suprised that he´s made a decision that goes against the Greater Middle East project and the interests of Israel. I don´t think this decision is going to last though, unless Israel is ok with it, which I doubt.

People are saying that he´s betrayed the Kurds, and I understand the logic behind that thought but from a Turkish point of view, the US has finally stopped betraying its NATO partner Turkey.

Say what you want about General Michael Flynn but he understood the problems that come with this scenario much better than most other people that Trump has worked with so far.

" I´d rather be a stank ass hoe because I´m not stupid. Oh my goodness! I got more drugs! I´m always funny dude...I´m hilarious! Are we gonna smoke?"




http://kooleasehvac.com/
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Reply #21 posted 10/07/19 4:46pm

poppys

KoolEaze said:

At least he´s keeping his campaign promise of bringing back the troops and so far he´s actually more peaceful than his predecessors. I´m suprised that he´s made a decision that goes against the Greater Middle East project and the interests of Israel. I don´t think this decision is going to last though, unless Israel is ok with it, which I doubt.

People are saying that he´s betrayed the Kurds, and I understand the logic behind that thought but from a Turkish point of view, the US has finally stopped betraying its NATO partner Turkey.

Say what you want about General Michael Flynn but he understood the problems that come with this scenario much better than most other people that Trump has worked with so far.

Hard to believe Trump is doing this to keep a campaign promise. He would leave troops somewhere forever if it benefitted him. There has to be a personal angle, or something he wants out of this beyond helping anyone.

politics: the art or science of government.
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Reply #22 posted 10/07/19 5:14pm

KoolEaze

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poppys said:

KoolEaze said:

At least he´s keeping his campaign promise of bringing back the troops and so far he´s actually more peaceful than his predecessors. I´m suprised that he´s made a decision that goes against the Greater Middle East project and the interests of Israel. I don´t think this decision is going to last though, unless Israel is ok with it, which I doubt.

People are saying that he´s betrayed the Kurds, and I understand the logic behind that thought but from a Turkish point of view, the US has finally stopped betraying its NATO partner Turkey.

Say what you want about General Michael Flynn but he understood the problems that come with this scenario much better than most other people that Trump has worked with so far.

Hard to believe Trump is doing this to keep a campaign promise. He would leave troops somewhere forever if it benefitted him. There has to be a personal angle, or something he wants out of this beyond helping anyone.

I´m not sure what to make of it, the situation is actually very complicated and there are so many different factors that need to be taken into account.

Keep in mind that both , Erdogan and Trump, are in a bit of trouble these days, and both of them want to be re-elected.

" I´d rather be a stank ass hoe because I´m not stupid. Oh my goodness! I got more drugs! I´m always funny dude...I´m hilarious! Are we gonna smoke?"




http://kooleasehvac.com/
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Reply #23 posted 10/07/19 9:00pm

benni

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KoolEaze said:

benni said:

Turkey has wanted this to be able to decimate the Kurds. Putin has also wanted this. This will be a genocide. The Kurdish people were our allies, fought ISIS along side our troops. Were a tremendous help during that fight, and this is what our country (Trump) gives them in return.

That sentence is far from the truth.

It is not an ethnic conflict between Turks and Kurds, even if your media tells you so.

If that were the case, Turkey wouldn´t have sheltered hundreds and thousands of Kurds when Saddam was trying to get rid of them in the 90s. And if Turkey wanted to "decimate" Kurds it wouldn´t be doing business or have close relations with the Kurds in North Iraq.

There are many, many factors involved here but it is not an ethnic conflict.



https://en.wikipedia.org/..._in_Turkey

This is just the introduction:


Kurds have had a long history of discrimination and massacres perpetrated against them by the Turkish government.[1] Massacres have periodically occurred against the Kurds since the establishment of the Republic of Turkey in 1923. Among the most significant is the Dersim rebellion where 13,160 civilians were killed by the Turkish Army and 11,818 people were taken into exile.[2] According to McDowall, 40,000 people were killed.[3] The Zilan massacre of 1930 was a massacre[4][5] of the Kurdish residents of Turkey during the Ararat rebellion, in which 5,000 to 47,000 were killed.[6]


The use of Kurdish language, dress, folklore, and names were banned and the Kurdish-inhabited areas remained under martial law until 1946.[7] In an attempt to deny their existence, the Turkish government categorized Kurds as "Mountain Turks" until the 1980s.[8][9][10][11] The words "Kurds", "Kurdistan", or "Kurdish" were officially banned by the Turkish government.[12] Following the military coup of 1980, the Kurdish language was officially prohibited in public and private life.[13] Many people who spoke, published, or sang in Kurdish were arrested and imprisoned.[14] Since the lifting of the ban in 1991, the Kurdish population of Turkey has long sought to have Kurdish included as a language of instruction in public schools as well as a subject. Currently, it's illegal to use the Kurdish language as an instruction language in private and public schools, yet there are schools giving education in Kurdish.[15][16][17]


During the Kurdish–Turkish conflict, food embargoes were placed on Kurdish populated villages and towns.[18][19] There were many instances of Kurds being forcefully deported out of their villages by Turkish security forces.[20] Many villages were reportedly set on fire or destroyed.[21][20] Throughout the 1990s and early 2000s, political parties that represented Kurdish interests were banned.[12] In 2013, a ceasefire effectively ended the violence until June 2015, when hostilities renewed between the PKK and the Turkish government over the Turkey–ISIL conflict. Violence was widely reported against ordinary Kurdish citizens and the headquarters and branches of the pro-Kurdish rights Peoples' Democratic Party were attacked by mobs.


[22] The European Court of Human Rights and many other international human rights organizations have condemned Turkey for the thousands of human rights abuses.[23][24] Many judgments are related to systematic executions of Kurdish civilians,[25] torturing,[26] forced displacements,[27] destroyed villages,[28][29][30] arbitrary arrests,[31] murdered and disappeared Kurdish journalists, activists and politicians.[32]


I'd say that it sounds like Turkey wants to decimate the Kurds, so much so that they outlaw their very way of life, their language, their identity.

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Reply #24 posted 10/07/19 9:10pm

benni

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"The persistence of genocide or near-genocidal incidents from the 1890s through the 1990s, committed by Ottoman and successor Turkish and Iraqi states against Armenian, Kurdish, Assyrian, and Pontic Greek communities in Eastern Anatolia, is striking. ... the creation of this "zone of genocide" in Eastern Anatolia cannot be understood in isolation, but only in light of the role played by the Great Powers in the emergence of a Western-led international system.


In the last hundred years, four Eastern Anatolian groups—Armenians, Kurds, Assyrians, and Greeks—have fallen victim to state-sponsored attempts by the Ottoman authorities or their Turkish or Iraqi successors to eradicate them. Because of space limitations, I have concentrated here on the genocidal sequence affecting Armenians and Kurds only, though my approach would also be pertinent to the Pontic Greek and Assyrian cases."

From "Holocaust and Genocide Studies"

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Reply #25 posted 10/07/19 10:14pm

TweetyV6

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Ugot2shakesumthin said:

I'll defend Trump on this. It's a mess with no real oversight or actual stratagey or objective that is doomed to flail for as long as we alowed it.

.

It looks bad but it's the right thing to do.

Ugot2shakesumthin said:

Here's my question. How do we think this would be resolved? What's the timeline? In our lifetime? How long must we stay there? The whole thing is so nebulous.
Unless the US decides that it will permanently remain there, I see no way out.

Exactly this.

The man of science has learned to believe in justification, not by faith, but by verification - Thomas Henry Huxley
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Reply #26 posted 10/08/19 3:42am

OnlyNDaUsa

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And if he would have done something y'all be calling him a war monger... that we are not the world police.

No one is coming for your abortion: they just want common-sense abortion regulations: background checks, waiting periods, lifetime limits, take a class, and a small tax.
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Reply #27 posted 10/08/19 6:26am

RodeoSchro

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Help me understand this. Is this the way it happened?

1. The president of Turkey and unrepentant serial adulterer Donald J. Trump have a phone call

2. Erdogan tells unrepentant serial adulterer Donald J. Trump, “We’re coming after the Kurds - in Syria, not even in Turkey - and you’re in the way”.

3. Unrepentant serial adulterer Donald J. Trump- a cowardly draft-dodger - says, “Not any more. We’re leaving Syria post-haste!”

Do I have that right? Because if I do, our Commander-in-Chief sure sounds like a wuss. Or compromised in some manner?
Second Funkiest White Man in America

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Reply #28 posted 10/08/19 6:29am

RodeoSchro

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OnlyNDaUsa said:

And if he would have done something y'all be calling him a war monger... that we are not the world police.




Now, that’s just a bunch of pig vomit diarrhea.
Second Funkiest White Man in America

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Reply #29 posted 10/08/19 6:58am

KoolEaze

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benni said:

KoolEaze said:

That sentence is far from the truth.

It is not an ethnic conflict between Turks and Kurds, even if your media tells you so.

If that were the case, Turkey wouldn´t have sheltered hundreds and thousands of Kurds when Saddam was trying to get rid of them in the 90s. And if Turkey wanted to "decimate" Kurds it wouldn´t be doing business or have close relations with the Kurds in North Iraq.

There are many, many factors involved here but it is not an ethnic conflict.



https://en.wikipedia.org/..._in_Turkey

This is just the introduction:


Kurds have had a long history of discrimination and massacres perpetrated against them by the Turkish government.[1] Massacres have periodically occurred against the Kurds since the establishment of the Republic of Turkey in 1923. Among the most significant is the Dersim rebellion where 13,160 civilians were killed by the Turkish Army and 11,818 people were taken into exile.[2] According to McDowall, 40,000 people were killed.[3] The Zilan massacre of 1930 was a massacre[4][5] of the Kurdish residents of Turkey during the Ararat rebellion, in which 5,000 to 47,000 were killed.[6]


The use of Kurdish language, dress, folklore, and names were banned and the Kurdish-inhabited areas remained under martial law until 1946.[7] In an attempt to deny their existence, the Turkish government categorized Kurds as "Mountain Turks" until the 1980s.[8][9][10][11] The words "Kurds", "Kurdistan", or "Kurdish" were officially banned by the Turkish government.[12] Following the military coup of 1980, the Kurdish language was officially prohibited in public and private life.[13] Many people who spoke, published, or sang in Kurdish were arrested and imprisoned.[14] Since the lifting of the ban in 1991, the Kurdish population of Turkey has long sought to have Kurdish included as a language of instruction in public schools as well as a subject. Currently, it's illegal to use the Kurdish language as an instruction language in private and public schools, yet there are schools giving education in Kurdish.[15][16][17]


During the Kurdish–Turkish conflict, food embargoes were placed on Kurdish populated villages and towns.[18][19] There were many instances of Kurds being forcefully deported out of their villages by Turkish security forces.[20] Many villages were reportedly set on fire or destroyed.[21][20] Throughout the 1990s and early 2000s, political parties that represented Kurdish interests were banned.[12] In 2013, a ceasefire effectively ended the violence until June 2015, when hostilities renewed between the PKK and the Turkish government over the Turkey–ISIL conflict. Violence was widely reported against ordinary Kurdish citizens and the headquarters and branches of the pro-Kurdish rights Peoples' Democratic Party were attacked by mobs.


[22] The European Court of Human Rights and many other international human rights organizations have condemned Turkey for the thousands of human rights abuses.[23][24] Many judgments are related to systematic executions of Kurdish civilians,[25] torturing,[26] forced displacements,[27] destroyed villages,[28][29][30] arbitrary arrests,[31] murdered and disappeared Kurdish journalists, activists and politicians.[32]


I'd say that it sounds like Turkey wants to decimate the Kurds, so much so that they outlaw their very way of life, their language, their identity.

Such a complex issue and you reply with a copy-and-paste job from Wikipedia?

.

.

As I said above, it is not an ethnic conflict. The massacres against Kurdish uprisings in the early 20th century were an effort by the government back then in order to end shariah and tribal law in that region. It was a process of forced modernization and a clash of different ideologies, old traditions against the new and secular, non-religious Turkish Republic that had just been founded in 1923.

That´s why Erdogan, whom I despise and hate for many reasons, officially apologized for the massacres in those early days of the republic. Because he and his followers are against secularism and have more in common with the majority of the Kurds....both are very conservative, very devout and have very oldfashioned views, and both are against everything that the Turkish Republic stands for. Tribal laws, so-called honor killings, ignorance, all of that can be found in Kurdish regions and there are many Kurds who are aware of that. But I´m not saying that it was right to force them to accept the new system. What I´m saying is that it was a clash of ideologies.....the rise of nationalism in the early 20th century played a big role, one nation, one language and so on. There are more than 35 ethnic groups in Turkey and none of them ask for their native language to be the official language.....even the citizens of Arab descent, a minority on the Syrian border, are not asking for Arabic as an official language.

As far as I´m concerned, I think any citizen should be able to use his or her native language freely and of course those languages should also be taught. Atrocities were committed, that´s true, but keep in mind that in that many of the massacres against the Armenians were also committed by Kurds back then, the Hamidiye troops in the late 19th century consisted of Kurds , and they also supported and participated in the massacres of 1915. The leader of the Kurdish party BDP apologized for that, just like Erdogan apologized for what the Turkish Republic did in the Kurdish populated regions.

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The conflicts of the late 1970s to early 1990s were more of a right against left conflict. If you were leftleaning in the 1970s and 1990s, you could end up in prison or dead, even if you were Turkish. By the way, the military coup of 1980 and its dreadful consequences for Kurdish AND Turkish people was a result of the Carter administration, or rather Paul Henze.

Back then they would do anything to prevent Turkey from going left because it was the height of the Cold War, so they supported General Evren and his anti-left, anti-Kurdish policies.

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The PKK received major support from Moscow and Syria back then. They started out as a Stalinist-Marxist guerilla group and it´s ironic that the USA , of all countries, supports a leftwing radical terrorist group that finances its war by drugselling, moneylaundering and human trafficking in Europe. It is a very complicated and messy situation in North Syria and there are many German and British Antifa members in the ranks of the YPG/PKK, side by side with Americans who fight for the YPG because of ISIS.

On the other hand you have millions of Turkish Kurds who still vote for Erdogan and support his world view and his neo Ottoman dreams, and who are strongly opposed to the PKK and YPG.

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As far as I´m concerned, I am against Erdogan´s plans but I understand why he would want to create a safe zone there and get rid of the YPG in that region. I´ve spoken with many Kurds and Arabs from that area and the YPG are not exactly saints or heroes there, unless you fall for what they and the media tell you.

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" I´d rather be a stank ass hoe because I´m not stupid. Oh my goodness! I got more drugs! I´m always funny dude...I´m hilarious! Are we gonna smoke?"




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