independent and unofficial
Prince fan community site
Wed 26th Feb 2020 3:26pm
Welcome! Sign up or enter username and password to remember me
Forum jump
Forums > Prince: Music and More > Estate Made The Right Decision On "Extralovable" & "Lust U Always"?
« Previous topic  Next topic »
Page 1 of 11 123456789>Last »
Reply   New topic   Printable     (Log in to 'subscribe' to this topic)
Author

Tweet     Share

Message
Thread started 01/03/20 8:01am

homesquid

avatar

Estate Made The Right Decision On "Extralovable" & "Lust U Always"?

Forget about being "woke" or this #METOO thing. The rape lyrics in those songs are simply vile. Evil. Prince never released these versions. Prince would have never released them with those lyrics included. You know that. The man matured. Besides do you really want to witness Prince getting "canceled" by the mob?

Now...having said that. Would it have been better to simply edit out the bad bits and release them?Honestly, I think that would have been better.

[Edited 1/3/20 8:03am]

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #1 posted 01/03/20 8:26am

EyeSpy

homesquid said:

Forget about being "woke" or this #METOO thing. The rape lyrics in those songs are simply vile. Evil. Prince never released these versions. Prince would have never released them with those lyrics included. You know that. The man matured. Besides do you really want to witness Prince getting "canceled" by the mob?



Now...having said that. Would it have been better to simply edit out the bad bits and release them?Honestly, I think that would have been better.

[Edited 1/3/20 8:03am]



It must have been a difficult decision for Michael Howe - such strong material to leave unreleased. But I completely understand the motive for leaving the two songs off the 1999 Super Deluxe Edition. What I will say however is that a proper analysis of this time period is simply not complete without these recordings and in particular Extraloveable which is surely one of best pieces of work from that era.

Therefore, my own personal preference would be for the estate to make these two songs available as a download only, perhaps with some sort of disclaimer. That way, us fans are satisfied as completists and the estate has avoided the backlash of those songs appearing on a major record release.
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #2 posted 01/03/20 8:40am

leadline

avatar

EyeSpy said:

homesquid said:

Forget about being "woke" or this #METOO thing. The rape lyrics in those songs are simply vile. Evil. Prince never released these versions. Prince would have never released them with those lyrics included. You know that. The man matured. Besides do you really want to witness Prince getting "canceled" by the mob?

Now...having said that. Would it have been better to simply edit out the bad bits and release them?Honestly, I think that would have been better.

[Edited 1/3/20 8:03am]

It must have been a difficult decision for Michael Howe - such strong material to leave unreleased. But I completely understand the motive for leaving the two songs off the 1999 Super Deluxe Edition. What I will say however is that a proper analysis of this time period is simply not complete without these recordings and in particular Extraloveable which is surely one of best pieces of work from that era. Therefore, my own personal preference would be for the estate to make these two songs available as a download only, perhaps with some sort of disclaimer. That way, us fans are satisfied as completists and the estate has avoided the backlash of those songs appearing on a major record release.


I don't agree with censorship in any form, but these songs were too important to leave off, especially Extraloveable, which easily would have been the strongest on the set. That being said, these words could have been edited out without anyone noticing a thing, without a beat being missed. Of all the liberties they have taken with his music, somehow taking out 1 word is crossing the line? Makes no sense.

"You always get the dream that you deserve, from what you value the most" -Prince 2013
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #3 posted 01/03/20 8:50am

LoveGalore

The songs are on YouTube and have been for years. Nobody gives a fuck.

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #4 posted 01/03/20 8:56am

Galaxy

Extra Loveable & Lust u Always should have been
Included on the 1999 Deulux Edition.
On both songs its Prince showing humour and being playful.
There is nothing evil about both of these songs
Some people are too serious.
Extra Loveable should have been released as a single.
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #5 posted 01/03/20 8:59am

VaultCurator

avatar

EyeSpy said:

It must have been a difficult decision for Michael Howe


I'm not sure that it was his decision strictly speaking, at least not entirely.

“Even though those two tracks are resolutely of the era, both tracks contain somewhat lamentable rape references. Given the egregiously insensitive candour of the lyrics and our lack of wanting to take creative license by editing or manipulating the tracks, we decided not to include them. Even though we want to shed light on the entire creative period, we certainly don’t want to be inflammatory or insensitive. We didn’t think it was right to include them.”

In this interview he seems to be speaking on behalf of a team. I'm under the impression that it's Michael's job to archive / digitize the material and WB gets the final say on what makes the cut.


 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #6 posted 01/03/20 9:35am

homesquid

avatar

Galaxy said:

Extra Loveable & Lust u Always should have been Included on the 1999 Deulux Edition. On both songs its Prince showing humour and being playful. There is nothing evil about both of these songs Some people are too serious. Extra Loveable should have been released as a single.

Bullshit. Rape is evil and joking about rape isn't funny or playful. You aren't serious enough. Prince should have never sang those words. He would be mortified by the negative blowback his reputation would get. They should have just edited out the words so crybabies like you would have what you wanted. But you'd still complain that they made those edits.

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #7 posted 01/03/20 10:30am

Neversin

avatar

homesquid said:

Galaxy said:

Extra Loveable & Lust u Always should have been Included on the 1999 Deulux Edition. On both songs its Prince showing humour and being playful. There is nothing evil about both of these songs Some people are too serious. Extra Loveable should have been released as a single.

Bullshit. Rape is evil and joking about rape isn't funny or playful. You aren't serious enough. Prince should have never sang those words. He would be mortified by the negative blowback his reputation would get. They should have just edited out the words so crybabies like you would have what you wanted. But you'd still complain that they made those edits.


There's a big difference between raping a person and singing/writing/acting/joking about it...
What's next; banning every movie/play/book that depicts rape in a way some oversensitive cunt doesn't agree with?!

Neversin.

O(+>NIИ<+)O

“Is man merely a mistake of God's? Or God merely a mistake of man's?”

- Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #8 posted 01/03/20 11:02am

LoveGalore

VaultCurator said:

EyeSpy said:

It must have been a difficult decision for Michael Howe


I'm not sure that it was his decision strictly speaking, at least not entirely.

“Even though those two tracks are resolutely of the era, both tracks contain somewhat lamentable rape references. Given the egregiously insensitive candour of the lyrics and our lack of wanting to take creative license by editing or manipulating the tracks, we decided not to include them. Even though we want to shed light on the entire creative period, we certainly don’t want to be inflammatory or insensitive. We didn’t think it was right to include them.”

In this interview he seems to be speaking on behalf of a team. I'm under the impression that it's Michael's job to archive / digitize the material and WB gets the final say on what makes the cut.


He's discussed the team of (I believe 3) stakeholders who decide the content before - him being one of them.

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #9 posted 01/03/20 11:25am

Genesia

avatar

Prince re-recorded Extraloveable, himself. That's the strongest indication possible that he no longer felt the original version was viable for release. People ask all the time, "What would Prince think/do about this?" In this case, we know beyond a reasonable doubt.

The rapey version is readily available. Anyone who feels so inclined may listen to it at will.

We don’t mourn artists because we knew them. We mourn them because they helped us know ourselves.
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #10 posted 01/03/20 11:33am

Galaxy

homesquid said:



Galaxy said:


Extra Loveable & Lust u Always should have been Included on the 1999 Deulux Edition. On both songs its Prince showing humour and being playful. There is nothing evil about both of these songs Some people are too serious. Extra Loveable should have been released as a single.


Bullshit. Rape is evil and joking about rape isn't funny or playful. You aren't serious enough. Prince should have never sang those words. He would be mortified by the negative blowback his reputation would get. They should have just edited out the words so crybabies like you would have what you wanted. But you'd still complain that they made those edits.




Both songs should have been released as singles now. Imagine the controversy that would have happened in today's sensitive climate. It's only a song. Like most we tolerated Prince good or bad why should this be any different. Prince should never be edited or you miss out on the magic he created. Also I have heard the unedited version of the songs heard it so many times all i wanted was in a better quality. Michael Howe and Co messed up very badly I even messaged him about these 2 songs.
The songs were his babies his creations and women loved him so we know there was nothing evil. Have a listen to those trax and enjoy the magic.
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #11 posted 01/03/20 11:35am

Galaxy

Neversin said:



homesquid said:




Galaxy said:


Extra Loveable & Lust u Always should have been Included on the 1999 Deulux Edition. On both songs its Prince showing humour and being playful. There is nothing evil about both of these songs Some people are too serious. Extra Loveable should have been released as a single.


Bullshit. Rape is evil and joking about rape isn't funny or playful. You aren't serious enough. Prince should have never sang those words. He would be mortified by the negative blowback his reputation would get. They should have just edited out the words so crybabies like you would have what you wanted. But you'd still complain that they made those edits.




There's a big difference between raping a person and singing/writing/acting/joking about it...
What's next; banning every movie/play/book that depicts rape in a way some oversensitive cunt doesn't agree with?!

Neversin.



Well said mate
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #12 posted 01/03/20 11:47am

sulls

avatar

homesquid said:

Forget about being "woke" or this #METOO thing. The rape lyrics in those songs are simply vile. Evil. Prince never released these versions. Prince would have never released them with those lyrics included. You know that. The man matured. Besides do you really want to witness Prince getting "canceled" by the mob?

Now...having said that. Would it have been better to simply edit out the bad bits and release them?Honestly, I think that would have been better.

[Edited 1/3/20 8:03am]

TROLL. confused

"I like to watch."
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #13 posted 01/03/20 11:55am

WhisperingDand
elions

avatar

Genesia said:

Prince re-recorded Extraloveable, himself. That's the strongest indication possible that he no longer felt the original version was viable for release. People ask all the time, "What would Prince think/do about this?" In this case, we know beyond a reasonable doubt.

The rapey version is readily available. Anyone who feels so inclined may listen to it at will.

...but he re-recorded/overdubbed/remixed/re-arranged every song he released after the project he created it for was already years past...

[Edited 1/3/20 11:59am]

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #14 posted 01/03/20 11:57am

WhisperingDand
elions

avatar

And I mean, there's a vast amount of music Prince "would have never released" as he "matured." Didn't he perpetually drop "Erotic City" for similar rationale? Better delete that one from your collections, too.

[Edited 1/3/20 11:59am]

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #15 posted 01/03/20 12:00pm

Strive

Genesia said:

Prince re-recorded Extraloveable, himself. That's the strongest indication possible that he no longer felt the original version was viable for release. People ask all the time, "What would Prince think/do about this?" In this case, we know beyond a reasonable doubt.

Prince was performing a new version of Purple Music with completely different lyrics before his death. Does that mean Purple Music shouldn't have been released on 1999 Deluxe?


The original version of Old Friends 4 Sale shouldn't be on Parade Deluxe because he re-recorded it with less personal lyrics?

[Edited 1/3/20 12:06pm]

Free the music, fire Michael Howe
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #16 posted 01/03/20 12:00pm

Galaxy

sulls said:



homesquid said:


Forget about being "woke" or this #METOO thing. The rape lyrics in those songs are simply vile. Evil. Prince never released these versions. Prince would have never released them with those lyrics included. You know that. The man matured. Besides do you really want to witness Prince getting "canceled" by the mob?



Now...having said that. Would it have been better to simply edit out the bad bits and release them?Honestly, I think that would have been better.


[Edited 1/3/20 8:03am]



TROLL. confused



He matured up but the songs were created by him. I was at one of his shows people shouting they want to hear Sexy Mf he did not sing it but he created it like Head Sexuality Gett Off etc that's his legacy.
Same can be applied for Extra Loveable & Lust U Always.
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #17 posted 01/03/20 12:07pm

WhisperingDand
elions

avatar

oh yeah, "Head", there's another one he "matured" past. Better get the delete button and trash compactors handy everyone.

[Edited 1/3/20 12:08pm]

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #18 posted 01/03/20 12:16pm

Genesia

avatar

Strive said:

Genesia said:

Prince re-recorded Extraloveable, himself. That's the strongest indication possible that he no longer felt the original version was viable for release. People ask all the time, "What would Prince think/do about this?" In this case, we know beyond a reasonable doubt.

Prince was performing a new version of Purple Music with completely different lyrics before his death. Does that mean Purple Music shouldn't have been released on 1999 Deluxe?


The original version of Old Friends 4 Sale shouldn't be on Parade Deluxe because he re-recorded it with less personal lyrics?

[Edited 1/3/20 12:06pm]


Do any of those songs reference rape?

We don’t mourn artists because we knew them. We mourn them because they helped us know ourselves.
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #19 posted 01/03/20 12:17pm

Genesia

avatar

WhisperingDandelions said:

Genesia said:

Prince re-recorded Extraloveable, himself. That's the strongest indication possible that he no longer felt the original version was viable for release. People ask all the time, "What would Prince think/do about this?" In this case, we know beyond a reasonable doubt.

The rapey version is readily available. Anyone who feels so inclined may listen to it at will.

...but he re-recorded/overdubbed/remixed/re-arranged every song he released after the project he created it for was already years past...


He redid every song? Yeah … no, he didn't.

We don’t mourn artists because we knew them. We mourn them because they helped us know ourselves.
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #20 posted 01/03/20 1:38pm

jfenster

what about the girl screaming for help at the end of DMSR?????? who gave estate/howe the final decisions????

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #21 posted 01/03/20 2:04pm

Genesia

avatar

Show of hands: How many of those who think the rapey songs are just fine and dandy are men?

We'll wait …

We don’t mourn artists because we knew them. We mourn them because they helped us know ourselves.
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #22 posted 01/03/20 2:04pm

LoveGalore

Genesia said:

Prince re-recorded Extraloveable, himself. That's the strongest indication possible that he no longer felt the original version was viable for release. People ask all the time, "What would Prince think/do about this?" In this case, we know beyond a reasonable doubt.

The rapey version is readily available. Anyone who feels so inclined may listen to it at will.

By no stretch of the imagination is that "beyond a reasonable doubt". Prince didn't bother explaining why he re-recorded the song, as far as I know, and that'd be the ONLY way that reasonable doubt would be met.

So then what is the issue with releasing them if they are readily available? Where's the moral outrage about these songs given how readily said access is? Hint: It doesn't exist and it wouldn't exist and the only thing they've done is ensured the future value of said songs when they ultimately cave and release them (which they will).

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #23 posted 01/03/20 2:44pm

Neversin

avatar

Genesia said:

Show of hands: How many of those who think the rapey songs are just fine and dandy are men?

We'll wait …



Sure, try to derail the topic into some man-hating cliché whine fest...
You want to cry about your man-hating dramedy then start a topic somewhere else and let fans discuss the topic at hand...

Neversin.
[Edited 1/3/20 15:01pm]
O(+>NIИ<+)O

“Is man merely a mistake of God's? Or God merely a mistake of man's?”

- Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #24 posted 01/03/20 3:08pm

Galaxy

Didn't Prince say someday everything will be released he wont but someday somebody will and
If the master tapes were not destroyed then he
Wanted it released. End Of discussion.
Extra Loveable and Lust u Always
I love the songs
Would the sensitives burn the Rainbow Children Album because they dont agree with the lyrics.
Not my beliefe but I love the Album. Its Art
and not something disgusting or perverted.
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #25 posted 01/03/20 3:14pm

Strive

Genesia said:

Show of hands: How many of those who think the rapey songs are just fine and dandy are men?

We'll wait …



Show of hands: How many of those complaining about Extralovable & Lust U Always because it has a naughty no-no word and they're unable to comprehend context, also never gave a second thought to Horny Toad where a sex-crazed Prince talks about harassing a woman until she lets him in, fingering her vagina until it bleeds and him getting off on their screams?



We'll wait ...




(PS. Horny Toad - Available on 1999 Deluxe at all major retailers with WB, the Estate and Michael Howe's personal approval lol )

[Edited 1/3/20 15:14pm]

Free the music, fire Michael Howe
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #26 posted 01/03/20 3:22pm

joyinrepetitio
n

avatar

We'll get Lust U Always, however, it will be the late 1986/87 version which he re-recorded for Robert Palmer. I wonder what that particular version sounds like. I'm sure somebody has a copy of it.

__________________________________________________
2 words falling between the drops and the moans of his condition
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #27 posted 01/03/20 4:05pm

mbdtyler

Genesia said:

Show of hands: How many of those who think the rapey songs are just fine and dandy are men?

We'll wait …

Probably most of them. Honestly, it bums me out how flippant some of these fans are about this topic. There's nothing "playful" about threatening sexual assault, it's just plain fucked up. There are plenty of (released) Prince songs I like where he pushes into uncomfortable territory with his lyrics, but at least mutual consent is usually implied. The minute that goes out the window, like in "Extraloveable", all fun and playfulness are immediately gone.

The most confusing part is that those lyrics add literally nothing to the song. They aren't necessary, they're just shocking for the sake of being shocking. I don't understand why anyone would put so much energy into defending their "artistic value" when they have none whatsoever within the context of the lyrics. All of the great art that tackles heavy subjects like rape usually has context, or something to drive home the trauma and violence of the topic. Where is that context in "Extraloveable"?

Without that, you're just advocating something that is arbitrarily tasteless, and that's a bad look. Not surprising coming from the folks who complain about "sensitive snowflakes" at any given chance, though.

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #28 posted 01/03/20 4:13pm

homesquid

avatar

Neversin said:

Genesia said:

Show of hands: How many of those who think the rapey songs are just fine and dandy are men?

We'll wait …

Sure, try to derail the topic into some man-hating cliché whine fest... You want to cry about your man-hating dramedy then start a topic somewhere else and let fans discuss the topic at hand... Neversin. [Edited 1/3/20 15:01pm]

Genesa asked a question and you are the one who whined about a non-existent "man-hating cliche whine fest". Replace your tampon, Neversin.

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #29 posted 01/03/20 4:16pm

homesquid

avatar

Genesia said:

Prince re-recorded Extraloveable, himself. That's the strongest indication possible that he no longer felt the original version was viable for release. People ask all the time, "What would Prince think/do about this?" In this case, we know beyond a reasonable doubt.

The rapey version is readily available. Anyone who feels so inclined may listen to it at will.

Excellent obsevation. Only idiots defending the "rape lyrics". Defintely going to be mostly men and crybabies who cry about crybabies being too PC.

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Page 1 of 11 123456789>Last »
Reply   New topic   Printable     (Log in to 'subscribe' to this topic)
« Previous topic  Next topic »
Forums > Prince: Music and More > Estate Made The Right Decision On "Extralovable" & "Lust U Always"?